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ididjaustralia · Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 1:21 pm Post subject: Groote style yiraka

Ok, here's my first attempt at Groote Eylandt style yiraka playing. The first clip is on a G instrument, the second on an E instrument. Any comments? I can't quite get the same asymmetry/irregularity as Guwanbal but I'm focussing mainly on tonguing technique rather than composition.

Guan

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kdidj · Joined: 23 Mar 2007 Posts: 255

Hey Guan,

It sounds good and rough but the first segment seems a bit short - if you lengthen the tail end of that you'll set up the asymmetrical bounce to the pattern. I prefer the recording in E as, not surprisingly, more of the tongue is heard.

I think both Djalu and Guwanbal play these rhythms with a 'crisper' tongue than the Groote fellows do if you know what I mean.

I'd love to hear more attempts - and by others too!

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Peter Lister · Joined: 10 Apr 2007 Posts: 214 Location: Australia

A sudden flurry of email acivity and I'm way behind....

Well I reckon what you're doing Guwan is very similar to Guwanbal and this sort of sound reminds me of Moyles' video that we raised here a couple of weeks back, but thinking back to her eother recordings - is it Vol 4 of SNT ??? - lLike Kyle I think the second part of the rhythm - I don't know how to describe it, it's drawn out more on those other recordings. I love that sound and then the brief arrest in the rhythm - just love it. I recall we spoke once about aspirations ot play Groote style - I think it was when I visited you in Melb all those years ago....neither of us could do it then and I haven't tried since but I never tire of listening to it. Certainly you're now capturing the essence of it I feel. Good on ya, ma.

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ididjaustralia · Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:39 pm Post subject:

kdidj wrote:

It sounds good and rough but the first segment seems a bit short - if you lengthen the tail end of that you'll set up the asymmetrical bounce to the pattern. I prefer the recording in E as, not surprisingly, more of the tongue is heard.

Hi Kyle, thanks for that. By first segment, do you mean the clip guangrootestyleG.mp3 itself? Or the riff?

kdidj wrote:

I think both Djalu and Guwanbal play these rhythms with a 'crisper' tongue than the Groote fellows do if you know what I mean.

I think that might just be the instrument used rather than the tonguing per se. It was a yidaki made by Winiwini, the sort of high backpressure high compression instrument that he loves playing. I should have recorded Guwanbal and Djalu on another instrument for comparative purposes but I didn't think of it at that time Crying or Very sad

Guan

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ididjaustralia · Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:42 pm Post subject:

Peter Lister wrote:

Well I reckon what you're doing Guwan is very similar to Guwanbal...

Guwan and Guwanbal... I like that! There's something I'm not doing though, that very subtle quick tonguing that sounds almost like a trill...

Guwan

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kdidj · Joined: 23 Mar 2007 Posts: 255

Hey Guys,

Sorry Guan, I meant the first segment of the vamp, not the first clip in G. To use David Turner's mouthsounds the main vamp is degul degula with the emphasis on the underlined sections and the breath on the 'a'. It's the slightly increased length of the 'gul' that sets up the asymmetrical tidal feel in this case. It's the tonguing through the 'degula' that when mixed with the passive voice really sets up the trill. Of course I'm not really mouthing 'degul degula' but it's a good approximation of the tongue movements.

The second part of the clip I posted was 'degul degulagula' again with the emphasis on the first 'gul' and the heavy trills of the 'degulagula' section following.

I agree with your choice of instrument. I played my clip on an old school Djalu in D with a fairly narrow bore from top to bottom - much like the Groote style instruments, which give a good response to the tonguing without the more robust impacts of more NEAL style attacks.

I guess, if I could sum it all up, it's the fluidity of the Groote styles that I find so intriguing.

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ididjaustralia · Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 6:26 pm Post subject:

kdidj wrote:

To use David Turner's mouthsounds the main vamp is degul degula with the emphasis on the underlined section and the breath on the 'a'. It's the slightly increased length of the 'gul' that sets up the asymmetrical tidal feel in this case. It's the tonguing through the 'degula' that when mixed with the passive voice really sets up the trill.

You lost me there Kyle!

Guan

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kdidj · Joined: 23 Mar 2007 Posts: 255

I know, it's hard to explain emphasis when you're writing. Basically, the rhythm sounds like

Da daaa

Da da ta

with each of the sections above being the same duration. Hopefully this makes sense!

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martin · Joined: 22 Mar 2007 Posts: 101

Love the asymmetric feel to these rhythms, and the delicate tonguing.
I enjoyed the variations between Guwanbal and Djalu, subtle but distinct differences in rhythm and a more
noticeable difference in sound - Djalu really has his own characteristic sound which is just beautiful to hear.

I also enjoyed Guan and Kyle's versions and variations. I should go and have a listen to vol4. of Moyles 5cds which has,
as Peter mentioned, several Groote island pieces on it. Maybe I will try to record something.

Guan, Kyle, what are the physical characteristics of a yiraka style instrument, differentiating it in particular from a yidaki?

Martin

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kdidj · Joined: 23 Mar 2007 Posts: 255

I would say that the two instruments are very similar in construction historically speaking, with a typical Groote instrument being like an old school yidaki with natural slightly flaring bore and generally long and skinny. In a survey of instruments used in the 1960s the general pitch was Eb.

It's my understanding that instrument selection on Groote and Bickerton Island today is now more influenced by the affiliated mainland based neighbouring clans and the more flared, higher pitched modern yidaki style is the norm.

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Peter Lister · Joined: 10 Apr 2007 Posts: 214 Location: Australia

Hi all,

I'd love ot embarass myself here and give you all a little chuckle by posting a sound file but I"m having trouble with the software I have at home saving what I'm doing as an mp3 file. I've got with me today two pretty poor attempts, just with the PC mike and saved as wav files and plan to get hold of some conversion software today to convert them to mp3. Anybody happy to receive them and give them a tickle for me and post them here ?? I recorded these on a skinny stick from Ramo - you know this stick Guan, one made for me by Roy Burrnyila back in 98 - very much like what you describe - skinny with a slowly tapering bore. I've still got sore lips today from last night - just haven't played for ages......

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Peter Lister · Joined: 10 Apr 2007 Posts: 214 Location: Australia

Plse disregard my request for conversion assistance folks - files are probably too big to send via email and I've managed to locate some software to do the trick so hopefully I'll get it sorted over the weekend.

thanks,

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flyangler18 · Joined: 23 Mar 2007 Posts: 394

To all forum members,

If you ever need to send large files and are worried about the size, I recommend YouSendIt.com. I use it frequently when I have to send large layouts and original RAW photos to clients.

Jason

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Peter Lister · Joined: 10 Apr 2007 Posts: 214 Location: Australia

Hi all,

well I've done it hopefully. Recording ones' playing is a great thing 'cos suddenly you can hear how bad you really are - but despite that I'm gonna post three files here. The first couple just recorded with the mike on the PC are better in many respects than the final one which was recorded with my minidisc and a decent microphone. Maybe my initial attempts are better because I'd imbibed some red and was therefore more relaxed ?? Certainly they are very revealing - you can easily hear how out of practise I am - very inconsistent and thinking too much !!

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ididjaustralia · Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 2:00 pm Post subject:

Hi Peter,

Good attempt mate. Groote style is bloody difficult, I'll have another go once I've listened to Moyle's recordings a bit... 'tis been a while since I heard those tunes...

Guan

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